絮言.狂想#033:廣東話達人挑戰陰謀大拆解?(客串:阿葆、Oscar)

近排喺英國詩歌大賽得獎嘅《Fricatives》究竟同語言學有咩關係,有幾深嘅意義?最近風靡全港嘅達人挑戰,廣東話版居然有大陰謀!?呢度個「呢」可以帶我哋返到去民族同化嘅起點?

今集我哋有幸邀請廣東話達人挑戰嘅兩位創作者阿葆同Oscar,同我哋一齊探討香港人對擦音嘅困惑,拆解達人挑戰背後嘅驚人發現。

嘉賓:
阿葆
Oscar

喺YouTube收聽

成爲 Patreon 會員除咗有足本逐字稿,仲有得投票、參與Discord,同埋以下額外內容添!
-飲水會發出乜嘢聲?

如果想單次打賞,亦都可以請我哋飲杯咖啡

本集特別鳴謝:Klaus、Anthony、サム、阿擇、Ceci

00:00 歡迎嘉賓!
02:35 英詩比賽香港人冠軍作品又關語言學事???
18:36 廣東話達人挑戰設計理念 
27:00 寓教育於挑戰
36:29 問題太深?應該問粗口?挑戰者點樣回應?
42:34 粵拼嘅現今、將來
50:26 十九世紀粵語
55:16 飲水.思源:「呢個」

連結:

意見反饋 Feedback/建議題目 Suggest topics

社交媒體

葆:即係平時大家一般人,你哋唔會想做啲咁難嘅嘢㗎嘛,大家平時實唔會咁難為自己㗎嘛,咁自虐㗎嘛。但係,哎,點知唔解突然間就喺呢個幾禮拜,大家興起咗一個自虐嘅風潮,好鍾意做一啲好難嘅嘢喎。

苗:香港人真係好鍾意考試。

[jingle]

以:歡迎大家返到嚟《絮言.狂想》第三十三集,我係以色列。

苗:我係三苗。

靳:我係靳尼啊。

以:好啦,噉大家如果有留意呢排嘅粵語、粵文界嘅事呢,可能都會好興奮啦。因為呢,就係好似我哋錄呢一集嘅一個零禮拜前?就出現咗呢個粵語嘅「達人挑戰」啦。噉其實就係……本來係由嗰個地理達人挑戰開始,之後大家就開始抄呢個idea啦,就喺Google Form度,喺度整好多唔同嘅挑戰啦,問啲好深嘅問題啦。噉大概講解下係咩嚟㗎啦,我好快講完喇。噉就係一啲同廣東話有關嘅問題啦,噉之後一開始好淺㗎,去到後面係黐線嘅,即係你就算網上查資料都做唔到嘅。噉呢,我哋陣間可以再仔細講啦,但係最緊要就係同大家講呢,我哋今日呢,就好興奮啦,因為我哋揾咗嗰個粵語達人挑戰嘅其中兩個創作者上嚟同我哋一齊傾偈啦,噉不如你哋介紹下自己?

葆:哈囉,我係阿葆,我係香港教育大學嘅博士後研究員嚟嘅。我本身係研究廣東話嘅。

柯:哈囉,我係柯,我而家喺香港都會大學嘅李嘉誠專業進修學院做緊助理講師嘅。噉呢,就……我而家係教緊英文嘅,噉但係其實我之前都用咗幾年時間,喺廣東話研究上面,就……係囉,花咗啲時間囉。即係我係喺嗰度讀Master噉樣嘅,完成咗嘅。

眾:好,歡迎歡迎。

苗:要有嗰個小朋友「耶!」嗰個。

以:又係嗰個?我用咗兩三次喇。公廁聲。

苗:用第二個,用第二個。

以:但係呢,我哋陣間再講個挑戰。點解呢?因為更加接近我哋錄音嘅時候呢,就有更興奮新聞啦。即係唔係想你哋比下去,但係我哋……我哋過去廿四小時係噉講呢單嘢啊,所以我哋就想講咗呢個先。係嘞。

苗:好嘞。噉呢,喺呢兩日呢,就英國嘅二〇二一年全國詩詞比賽嘅冠軍呢,就……就出爐啦,噉就係一個香港嘅詩人嚟嘅。噉佢就係即係十九歲啦,噉就而家喺劍橋嗰度讀緊書啦。

以:讀經濟嘅。

苗:係嘞。噉呢一個特別之處呢,就首先……即係當然佢係香港人啦。噉第二就係佢係史上最年輕嘅冠軍得主嚟嘅。噉都非常之犀利啦。噉究竟呢一首詩同語言學有咩關係呢?噉我哋就一睇嘅時候呢,就見到:咦?個標題原來叫做《Fricatives》,呢個摩擦音呀?點讀?

靳:擦音。

苗:擦音啦,係喇。噉就一個發聲嘅方式啦。噉佢原來裏面呢,就講到一啲關於口音同埋身份之間嘅關係嘅。噉即係可能大家都知道英文喺香港口音嘅時候,即係th呢啲音呢,就好多時會讀成f嘅,即係譬如three呢個數字啦,同埋free自由,噉就可能會讀成free啦,兩個都係。噉其實就唔單只淨係香港嘅口音先係噉啦,即係英國自己本身都有一啲本土嘅……比較可能市井少少嘅口音呢,佢哋都係會有呢一種噉樣嘅讀法嘅,都有一啲呢啲階級觀念嘅意味啦。噉佢呢一首詩就即係用咗呢一個嚟做一個引子,一開始就講口音,噉之後就帶到去一啲可能係香港人移民到去英國,或者即係移民in general呢樣嘢,就令到你個身份有啲咩唔同,或者即係呢一樣嘢,英國呢一個case……

以:融合嘅問題囉,我諗。

苗:係囉,即係究竟我哋應該係去嘗試去跟一啲所謂正統啊,或者係叫做正確嘅音吖,定係我哋其實可以唔理呢啲嘢,去保留返自己嗰個身份呢?噉樣。噉呢一首詩都探討咗呢啲噉樣嘅問題。

以:噉我哋仔細傾之前呢,首先就我哋擺條link喺show notes啦,噉大家去睇下嗰首詩先啦。呢啲真係要體驗先感受到嘅。

苗:嗰個得獎者Eric Yip,佢就上咗英國即係BBC Radio上面其中一個節目,噉佢都有朗讀返佢自己嗰首詩,同埋都有一個訪問噉樣嘅。

Eric Yip朗誦:

To speak English properly, Mrs. Lee said, you must learn

the difference between three and free. Three men

escaped from Alcatraz in a rubber raft and drowned

on their way to Angel Island. Hear the difference? Try

this: you fought your way into existence. Better. Look

at this picture. Fresh yellow grains beaten

till their seeds spill. That’s threshing. That’s

submission. You must learn to submit

before you can learn. You must be given

a voice before you can speak. Nobody wants to listen

to a spectacled boy with a Hong Kong accent.

You will have to leave this city, these dark furrows

stuffed full with ancestral bones. Know

that death is thorough. You will speak of bruised bodies

skinnier than yours, force the pen past batons

and blood, call it fresh material for writing. Now

they’re paying attention. You’re lucky enough

to care about how the tongue moves, the seven types

of fricatives, the articulatory function of teeth

sans survival. You will receive a good education

abroad and make your parents proud. You will take

a stranger’s cock in your mouth in the piss-slick stall

of that dingy Cantonese restaurant you love and taste

where you came from, what you were made of all along.

Put some work into it, he growls. C’mon, give me

some bite. Your mother visits one October, tells you

how everyone speaks differently here, more proper.

You smile, nod, bring her to your favourite restaurant,

order dim sum in English. They’re releasing

the students arrested five years ago. Just a tad more

soy sauce please, thank you. The television replays

yesterday on repeat. The teapots are refilled. You spoon

served rice into your mouth, this perfect rice.

Steamed, perfect, white.

以:我哋可以開始傾嘞。其實口音嘅問題,我哋之前有一集都講過啦。因為尤其是英文作為國際語言呢,即係永遠特別多呢啲你口音同你身份嘅關係啊,噉嘅問題啦,或者係唔同口音之間嘅歧視啊,等等各種嘅問題。噉佢呢一首,佢就……我覺得好聰明囉,就係用一個咁specific嘅嘢,就係呢個th同f嘅分別,嚟到帶出咁多嘅意思。噉不如問咗嘉賓先啦,你哋有冇睇到啊?有咩感受呢?睇完之後。

柯:好啊。其實我都好……又唔係睇咗好耐,即係我冇仔細研究啦,其實我即係有時間淨係睇咗頭一半,都已經覺得:嘩,好多寶藏啊,噉樣樣。因為其實佢不斷喺度探討緊即係th音啊,同埋f音啊,噉樣樣。噉我都即係因為……其實小弟嘅英文呢,又唔係話真係十分之犀利噉樣,噉所以有啲字呢,即係我都要究竟……查返究竟佢……譬如f音,佢嘅th版本,或者th嗰個字嘅f版本,有冇……有冇第二個字嘅出現?噉我就再套返落去噉樣樣。噉我就發覺:啊,其實佢都幾聰明喎。即係譬如我見到佢fresh同埋threshing噉樣樣,哦,原來係有意思嘅。即係……係喇。即係其實你互換嘅話呢,其實都係……都係有兩個possible嘅意思嘅。噉我都……譬如話thought同埋fought,即係you fought your way into existence啦。噉其實你都可以變成you thought your way into existence噉樣。噉跟住我就覺得:嘩……

以:即係你「諗」同埋你「打」。

苗:我思故我在喎。

柯:係嘞。噉我就……我就暫時我就因為唔係太多時間,所以呢,我就淨係去到中間嗰度呢,就睇緊呢啲嘢啦,即係睇到呢度噉樣。噉就都嘩,其實即係個作者,即係……如果佢係講緊十九歲,嘩,佢玩word play都玩得幾出神入化喎,噉樣樣。噉暫時係噉樣嘅……嘅first impression囉。

以:你唔係睇咗好耐,都已經查咗咁多資料嗱?好有心機……

苗:好犀利啊。查得多過我。

靳:走去查咗。

柯:唔係啊,我都係查字典啫,查返f音同埋th音嗰啲啫,噉樣樣。

以:嗯,你講嗰個threshing呢,我就係有查到嘅。噉我記得f嗰個呢,就係新鮮啦,或者係清爽嘅意思啦,噉佢就係講fresh material,即係你寫作嘅時候,用啲新嘅諗法啊、新嘅材料噉樣啦。噉另外threshing呢,就係一個冇人識嘅字嚟嘅。Threshing原來係一啲同穀物有關嘅詞語啦,我都唔知實體睇係咩意思嘅。噉但係佢有一句呢,佢就係用呢個穀物嚟做一啲比喻嘅,噉之後就引出咗threshing呢個字,噉就係講啲……啲植物比人打到……係啊,我唔識種田啊,所以我唔知做㗎,總之佢打到出咗啲……出嚟噉樣。

靳:因為呢度其實有一樣嘢呢,又係好巧妙嘅,因為佢……佢真係有同你解釋到呢,咩叫threshing,因為threshing其實就係「打穀」噉解。打穀係乜嘢呢?就係你成抽噉樣嘅穀物呢,跟住就喺個地下嗰度,係噉喺度打個地下,跟住就打鬆啲穀物,跟住令到嗰啲種子可以飛出嚟噉樣。噉跟住佢……佢形容呢樣嘢,佢就話fresh yellow grains beaten till their seeds spill,即係佢將一啲……呢啲黃色嘅穀物,打到佢出咗嚟噉樣。

以:爆。

靳:噉跟住佢其實係呼應咗啦,佢去到最後,嗰個主角就喺度食緊飯。噉佢就形容啲飯呢,steamed, perfect, white,又完美又白噉樣。噉呢個就係有好多帶有一啲喺種族啊,或者喺認同上高,即係一啲嘅比喻啊噉樣,都好……都好深深噉樣擺咗入去呢啲黃色同埋白色啊,呢啲f同埋th啊,噉就好明……好完美噉樣結合咗出嚟,噉所以係真係好犀利。

以:吓?你講呼應嘅時候,我以為你講緊呼應佢話喺新聞度睇到放咗啲畀人拉咗嘅學生出嚟。因為即係我覺得好多人睇呢首詩,都係諗咗即係一啲暴力嘅事件啦,畀人打到唔知咩噉啦。噉尤其是呢,threshing,係喇,啱啱講咗呢個其中一個意思啦,就係打穀啦。另一個意思呢,噉我懷疑係通thrashing嘅。噉就係即係掙扎噉樣嘅意思。

苗:係喎,真係好有想像力。

以:所以我係諗咗嗰樣嘢嘅。三苗都好多想像力㗎,你喺度謙啫。不如又問下阿葆有冇咩感受啦。你又睇咗啲咩出嚟呢? 葆:其實呢,呢首詩本身我嘅領會唔多啊,但係呢,我留意到一個週邊嘅現象啊。就係呢,我見呢,有人呢,就話呢一首詩呢,一開始即係傳到嚟我哋香港啦,有呢個消息嘅時候啦,噉傳媒啊,對於佢哋……即係對於首詩嗰個關注同埋對於呢首詩歌個作者呢,係關注喺某一方面㗎喎。

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